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Frog chess[Subject Thread] [Add Response]
James Zuercher wrote on Thu, Nov 14, 2019 01:36 AM UTC:

How does Frog Chess compare with normal chess and Capablanca chess in terms of percent draws?


Kevin Pacey wrote on Thu, Nov 14, 2019 02:30 AM UTC:

If you mean the Frog Chess variant that I invented some year(s) ago, and submitted to this CVP website, I only know of the games that have been played so far on Game Courier (on this website), and at the moment there's been no draws in about 17 games (one opponent long ago deleted an unfinished game I had been playing with him, after he apparently realized he had been counting on an illegal frog piece move, that he tried soon enough).

However, other than myself, I don't know of any chess master who has played Frog Chess on Game Courier. Below elite player level in chess (that is, well beyond master level), draws are far less likely, in over-the-board games, simply because there are more mistakes made by non-elites, and it's assumed a very well played game of chess should end in a draw.

I don't know of the drawing percentages for Capablanca Chess, but on Game Courier (on this website), I wouldn't be surprised if there are next to no draws, even though many games have been played with it. Again, one reason would be that the players here are nowhere near world chess elite strength in terms of skill at chess or other chess variants, as far as I know, and my own guess is that Capablanca Chess is far from being an extremely drawish game (the same would go for Frog Chess). Lastly, it may be worth noting that there are no books on Frog Chess or Capablanca Chess (afaik), unlike for chess, so players of any level would be feeling their way in the dark rather more.

Here's a link to the logs of finished Frog Chess games as played on Game Courier so far:

https://www.chessvariants.com/play/pbm/logs.php?game=Frog+Chess&age=0&stat=finished

[edit: Here's a link to the logs of finished Capablanca Chess games played on Game Courier so far - one in 45 was drawn to date; it was one of my games, agreed drawn since there was a long delay before a bug to the preset was fixed, a bug which affected that game in particular:]

https://www.chessvariants.com/play/pbm/logs.php?game=Capablanca+Chess&age=0&stat=finished

[edit: Here's a link to the logs of finished Chess games played on Game Courier so far - ten in 159 were drawn to date:]

https://www.chessvariants.com/play/pbm/logs.php?game=Chess&age=0&stat=finished

[edit: For what it's worth, in International Master John Watson's 1998 book, Secrets of Modern Chess Strategy, he quotes monster chess database figures as 40-30-30 in terms of post-1965 White win-Drawn-Black win percentages for all levels of competitive tournament chess players taken as a whole, and says these rates have been quite stable; note the figures also mean that White scores 55%, and Black 45%, in terms of results.]


Kevin Pacey wrote on Thu, Nov 14, 2019 04:36 AM UTC:

I've added to my previous post with some edits, in case anyone missed it.


H. G. Muller wrote on Thu, Nov 14, 2019 09:45 AM UTC:

Capablanca Chess has about 16% draw rate between equal players, compared to orthodox Chess about 32%. (That doesn't account for the limit of near-perfect play, possibly with the aid of exhaustive opening theory that prevents mistakes before the game reaches the stage of a dead draw.)

Draw rates tend to fall for games within a group of players of very diverse strength, as many games will be a guaranteed win for the strongest player.


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