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Turnover. Three ring sizes fit into each other, combining and splitting into different pieces, sometimes taking over your opponent's.[All Comments] [Add Comment or Rating]
💡📝Lúcio José Patrocínio Filho wrote on Wed, Jun 19, 2019 04:18 AM EDT:

Check it up and add Turnover Chess Variant on your site:

https://instagram.com/boardgameturnover/

https://www.facebook.com/BoardGameTurnover/


H. G. Muller wrote on Wed, Jun 19, 2019 04:48 AM EDT:

Looks like an interesting game, although I am not sure it qualifies as a chess variant. Could you explain the rules? They are not on a pubicly accessible website, in so far I could find.

[Edit] Oh, I found a description in a PDF file on Google Drive. Some things are not yet clear to me, though:

  • It says the Pawn only moves one step. But is this only forward, or can it also move backward, when going to an empty square?
  • It says the win is by taking or turning all enemy Castles. But Castles can also be destroyed by their owner, through splitting them up. Which is neither taking nor turning.) Is it illegal to split up your last Castle?
  • What if I capture my opponent's last Castle by splitting up my own last Castle? Is this allowed? And if not, who would be at fault? Is it more forbidden to split up the last Castle, or more forbidden to move into its capture range?
  • Does a promotion reset the 50-move counter?
  • Does combining friendly pieces count as a turnover, for resetting the 50-move count?

JT K wrote on Wed, Jun 19, 2019 09:20 AM EDT:

I'm intrigued and it looks cool, but confused by the knight being a bishop + pawn.  I suppose so many things are breaking apart and coming back together that its value doesn't have to always match the sum of its parts.  Maybe the knights are used at opportunistic times only?  Shout out to Furgus Duniho for the very similar Fusion Chess, but I'll grant that this adds pawns into the mix (and I love how the openings play out), and I also like the visual simplicity of literally adding the rings together.


H. G. Muller wrote on Wed, Jun 19, 2019 10:10 AM EDT:

Indeed, the particular combinations of rings that you have at any moment is not really preserved for a long time, nor hard to improve when sub-optimal. Piece values only have meaning in more conventional chess games because you typically will be stuck with a piece for a very long time, possibly to the end of the game, and if you have a weaker piece there is not much you can do to trade it for something more valuable. Here the actual combination is more like a positional advantage. Temporarily having the Bishop lose its moves by combining it with a Pawn is similar to blocking a good diagonal for a Bishop with a Pawn in orthodox Chess. (The Bishop might keep some of its other moves in that case, but here the 'Pawn' will temporarily acquire Knight ability, which should provide even better compensation.)

Yet you probably would not strive for combining your own Bishops with a Pawn. But remember that you can also 'turnover' an enemy Bishop by merging it with your Pawn, and that would be extremely advantageous, as now it is the opponent that loses the Bishop, and won't get it back when you split them up again. It would in fact be pretty hard for him to get it back at all. So it is really the value of the individual rings that play the role of piece values here.


💡📝Lúcio José Patrocínio Filho wrote on Mon, Jun 24, 2019 04:00 PM EDT:
  • Pawn moves ahead one square and take diagonal forward one square. Pawn turnover ahead one square.
  • Yes, is illegal to split up your last Castle, but if you have the last castle in check and it can turnover a queen ahead to get free from check so you can do it.
  • Good question. Capture the opponent's last Castle by splitting up your own last Castle is a illegal move, because the result is no castles on board.
  • "Does a promotion reset the 50-move counter?" It works like it on traditional chess? I don't know, but seems interesting question, I vote to reset :)
  • "Does combining friendly pieces count as a turnover, for resetting the 50-move count?" No. Combining friendly pieces is not turnover, because a turnover is a take possession, like turnover in american football.

💡📝Lúcio José Patrocínio Filho wrote on Mon, Jun 24, 2019 05:06 PM EDT:

[I'm intrigued and it looks cool, but confused by the knight being a bishop + pawn.  I suppose so many things are breaking apart and coming back together that its value doesn't have to always match the sum of its parts.  Maybe the knights are used at opportunistic times only?  Shout out to Furgus Duniho for the very similar Fusion Chess, but I'll grant that this adds pawns into the mix (and I love how the openings play out), and I also like the visual simplicity of literally adding the rings together.]

Turnover, like chess, goes beyond a simple game, it has esoteric symbolisms. Castle made by 3 pieces has the symbolism of number 3. Keep board with 8x8 squares has the symbolism of number 7 and tetraktis 4+3+2+1 etc. Bishop is the magical or spiritual piece of chess, and it moves like a cross to bring a lot of other symbolisms that confirms the esoteric value of chess. Bishop + Pawn = knight because it is a man (pawn) with power (spiritual power from bishop), so in medieval battle, knights is it, a man mounted in a horse is much more stronger.

 

If you play the game, you will realise its difference on tactics, because you are sharing pieces with opponent. It create a kind of statu quo between pieces and it is really interesting. New players of course will play trash matches, but good turnover players can make passionate matches, and I swear, is really almost impossible to draw in Turnover, because this game is very offensive. So, yes, is very dangerous create knights, because bishops are very useful and when you move a knight you let behind a bishop and the opponent can think a strategy to take your bishop.

About simplicity, the game uses only 3 pieces, a magical number and a strong algorithm to the way human mind works. So when you are playing the game, seems all possible moves from all pieces on board can be visualized in your mind and it is good, because your mind can dedicate more time to think what move instead of recognize pieces first to think what move after. And your mind stress less then in chess.

Play Turnover: 

Player vs computer: https://glukkazan.github.io/checkmate/turnover.htm

Player vs player: https://glukkazan.github.io/checkmate/turnover-board.htm

Player vs computer (PawnFreeToCombine): https://glukkazan.github.io/checkmate/turnover-variant.htm

Player vs player (PawnFreeToCombine): https://glukkazan.github.io/checkmate/turnover-variant-board.htm


Ben Reiniger wrote on Mon, Jun 24, 2019 09:39 PM EDT:

I agree that this looks interesting.

I've moved the discussion over from the homepage to comments here.  I've made the link description more descriptive, and corrected some of the categories (your choices were understandable, but most of them mean something different here; something we should clarify).  The formatting of this page should be cleaned up; I can do it later if you're not up to it.


💡📝Lúcio José Patrocínio Filho wrote on Tue, Jun 25, 2019 06:25 AM EDT:

All info, games, sites and social media about Turnover Chess Variant:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/boardgameturnover/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/boardgameturnover

Blog: https://turnovergame.blogspot.com/

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQMrbXcIavQ&list=PLqgqCH3Tmc8VDLktU2graQKa2Jwi3FkHl

Play online Player vs Player: https://glukkazan.github.io/checkmate/turnover-board.htm

Play online Player vs computer: https://glukkazan.github.io/checkmate/turnover.htm

Turnover Chess Variants and dozens of other games by programmer Валентин Челноков (Valentin Chelnokov: https://glukkazan.github.io/


H. G. Muller wrote on Tue, Jun 25, 2019 08:10 AM EDT:

Ok, so the rule that you cannot destroy your own last Castle takes precedence, like in Atomic Chess. So with W: Cd1 B: Ce3, Qd2 it would be allowed to play Cxd2=C, as your new Castle would not be in check on d2.

I see there is an AI that plays this. Is that really strong, or is it just a demo?


💡📝Lúcio José Patrocínio Filho wrote on Tue, Jun 25, 2019 04:54 PM EDT:

[H. G. Muller wrote on 2019-06-25 CEST

Ok, so the rule that you cannot destroy your own last Castle takes precedence, like in Atomic Chess. So with W: Cd1 B: Ce3, Qd2 it would be allowed to play Cxd2=C, as your new Castle would not be in check on d2.

I see there is an AI that plays this. Is that really strong, or is it just a demo?]

No. CxQd2 = pawn, because castles and pawns just take diagonal forward. They dont turnover on diagonal forward, they turnover just forward. This special rule for castles and pawns I create to honor traditional chess' pawns and to balance possibilities to take Bishops, Queens and all other combinations. So pawns are like in chess, warriors tanking the enemy, just take diagonal forward and move forward, so in turnover their takes are reserved to diagonal forward move while normal move and turnover or combine with friendly pieces is reserved to forward move. Nonetheless say that the double square move from first pawn move on traditional chess is honored by same possibility to move two squares ahead by castles.

In your example, White can move ahead to turnover with Queen, but Black cannot because its not in front, so the result will be a take instead a turnover.

This is a simple AI, too weak, just for demo review.

I really apreciate your interest and comments. Thank you. I hope more people get interest too.

 

 


H. G. Muller wrote on Tue, Jun 25, 2019 05:11 PM EDT:

But d1 to d2 is not diagonal. Perhaps 'x' is wrong notation for this that confused matters.


💡📝Lúcio José Patrocínio Filho wrote on Wed, Jun 26, 2019 03:38 PM EDT:

Have a look on this example in animated gif:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1-k8JTNaBAFNmMrd_NTB9nvfBqFhKWNTp

I think it is about your question. Thank you.


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